I call this the shifting goal posts theory.

At some point Obama will have to fully endorse a particular piece of legislation. Until then, despite Obama’s pronouncement that “the time for debate is over”, the time for debate hasn’t even really started yet.

Who is here defending the Baucus bill? You are totally confused.

The main Republican opposition has indeed been “death panels,” socialist takeovers, and whatever other conspiracy theories Glenn Beck and Rush Limbaugh come up with.

Pointing out that the latest form of Obamacare would represent a substantive departure from Obama’s pledge to not raise taxes on the middle class is not whining about death panels.

Rather, it’s a point for which the proponent of ObamaCare have no good answer. Which is why when George Stephanopoulos pressed Obama about this last Sunday, Obama had to use his Alinsky tactics by seizing on the fact that the dictionary was used rather than actually answering the question.

I’ve seen this kind of debating tactic once or twice before.

They already do. We are already paying for people with no insurance, illegal or otherwise. According to that argument, we should do away with Medicare and Medicaid, two government programs that do just what you are worried about.

“Whatever they may do or say now, the Democrats will find a way to get illegals covered, if only as a result of the inevitable “comprehensive immigration reform” legislation that we can expect from the Obama administration.”

Sounds like a phobia actually. You can do better than that Lisa.

“It’s curious to me why you, Chris, don’t seem to have much interest in discussing the alternatives I have already presented in previous posts, and instead choose to focus on the peripheral issues surrounding the health care debate.”

Your alternatives are not plans put forth by your Party. Why discuss it? Your Party is going around fear mongering about death panels and government takeovers. Anything else is ignoring what’s really going on.

Tea Baggers and their lies are not fringe. Actual elected Republican officials (Members of Congress) are going around the country talking about death panels, concentration camps, government takeovers, etc. This is mainstream Republicanism. I understand your concern, but it was noticeably absent when Bush was in power.

If there was a commitment to preventing illegals from taking advantage of government-funded health care, then why did the Democrats previously vote down amendments clarifying this point? Whatever they may do or say now, the Democrats will find a way to get illegals covered, if only as a result of the inevitable “comprehensive immigration reform” legislation that we can expect from the Obama administration.

It’s curious to me why you, Chris, don’t seem to have much interest in discussing the alternatives I have already presented in previous posts, and instead choose to focus on the peripheral issues surrounding the health care debate.

Do I wish that some of these protesters would stick to cold hard facts and leave the crazy stuff to the privacy of their own homes? Absolutely. But there’s more upside than downside when the American people start paying attention to what the federal government is doing, no matter which party is in power. In every political movement there is some level of fringe participation. In the case of the tea party movement, there is no official leader. If/when one is selected, then there will be more policing of that fringe group. Until then, there’s nothing the average person can do about that.

No amount of carping about death panels or any other straw man argument about lies and disinformation will change the fact that The American people aren’t going along with ObamaCare as its been presented thus far.

The Democrats should spend less time whining about the minority party’s opposition and more time crafting a bill that might actually be deemed acceptable by the American people because its actually a set of ideas worth enacting.

The GOP would be the first to call what Wilson did anti-Americanism. I can’t imagine what would happen if a Democrat did the same thing to George W. Bush.

As for the content that Obama wants to provide insurance to illegal immigrants, that’s just absurd and along the same lines as the GOP’s embrace of death panels and socialist takeovers. The whole Party is one big conspiracy theory.

Moreover, the content of the bill specifically mentions, like you say, that illegal aliens would not receive tax payer assistance. Much like we can’t forbid illegals to buy a loaf of bread, the bill won’t prevent illegals from purchasing public insurance with their own money. What’s wrong with that?

All this is is another scare tactic by the right wing. Next week it will be Obama wants to kill babies through a public option. Then it will be Obama wants to prevent whites from having insurance. All the hot-topic wacko buttons the GOP is built around will be touched before this is all over.